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Nathan has been crafting music for the past 9 years or so, ever since the demise of his previous band Frodus, who many agree departed too soon (possibly even Nathan himself, as seen by his project’s name which is taken from a song on the band’s final studio release).
Previously working with one-time Lujo artist Chase Barber aka Brahm in his Out_Circuit debut Burn Your Scripts, Boys and again in their side project Night Is Invisible, Nathan has since expanded his collaborative palette to include friends Dustin Kensrue (Thrice), Sean Ingram (Coalesce, The People’s Court), Matt Johnson (Roadside Monument), wife Rachel Burke (Beauty Pill) and more. And if that’s not enough parenthetical nudging for you (oh yeah, artwork by Don Clark), the album was produced mixed by Teppei Teranishi, also of Thrice, which undoubtedly pushes the final product’s quality to unquestionable heights.
Over five years in the making (and well worth the wait) The Out_Circuit’s sophomore release Pierce The Empire With A Sound immediately establishes itself as boundless with the aggressive track “Come Out Shooting” transforming into the dark/soft “Passchendaele” followed by the heavenly dreamscape “Across the Light”. The rest plays out just the same: multifaceted, intimate, heavy and hypnotic.
Zach Bard sat down with artist Nathan Burke last December in anticipation for the release of “Empire” which hit stores this week.
Burn Your Scripts, Boys was released in 2004, I believe, while Pierce the Empire with a Sound is slated for an early 2008 release. Was there any reason specifically for the long hiatus between records or was it more of a natural thing, no rush?
“Scripts” was released in 2004, but it was actually finished 3 years before it was released. So that’s six years between the completion of records, but its not like I’ve been working on it the whole time. There were lots of reasons, but suffice to say it has been a very busy few years. In the time since the completion of the last record I got married, graduated college, moved across the country, got a job, bought a house, had a kid, among other things. I would work on it here and there with long gaps between because it was often a much lower priority than other things and I really only felt like I could work on it when that other stuff was in order. There were a couple other factors, just getting the money together, etc, and weird things like me breaking my arm pretty severely in June of 2006 in a moped accident. I actually tracked a few keyboard parts with my good arm while the other was in a cast, but obviously that slowed things down a lot. Truth is if I’d done nothing but work on this record straight through I could have finished it in a few months.
Let’s talk about your previous band Frodus for a minute. This is a band who was on two record labels that have really come into their own since. Tooth and Nail with it’s Billboard-topping Underoath and Fueled by Ramen with Fall Out Boy. In the same way the buzz with Frodus really grew, it seems, after the band had released their final record and started to break up. (You even toured with Refused, who it seems, really grew in popularity posthumously.) Do you ever feel like the band was just ahead of its time. Like if you would have stayed together a bit longer, there would have been a lot more opportunity?
I’ve thought about that a few times, but I can honestly say I feel very content with what we did and the level of success we had. Maybe it could have been more, but I have no regrets. What matters to me more than record sales or popularity is the respect we garnished. I am still blown away and humbled when I meet people who were really into Frodus and really got it, especially the last record. It’s interesting to think, though, that if the band had been a bit more successful, maybe just enough to keep us doing it, I might never have gone down the paths I did, and I’m glad I have. If the tour with Refused had happened even 6 months later, it would have been much bigger (which wouldn’t have been hard, it was a very small tour). But again, maybe that kind of success at that time wouldn’t have been good for us personally. It might have been a carrot dangling just a little closer in front of us for a longer amount of time, keeping us from other things. I know that it was easier to walk away when the time came because there was so much heavy stuff in our lives we needed to deal with and not worry about being in a band for a while.
After listening to Frodus’ “Weapons” and then hearing The Out Circuit, one can see your touch in that band. Your name is even derived from a song on that record. Were you beginning to experiment with what would become TOC on that record, or were you making that music all along?
I think I was developing that sound all along. The music I made before I was in Frodus was much more akin to ambient/atmospheric music, so when I started The Out Circuit it was an attempt to go back to some of that but with the lessons and tastes I had infused from my time in Frodus. That said, I do see this as a logical progression from Frodus, which isn’t to say we would’ve sounded like this, but more for me personally. The transition happened in part because Frodus ended, but I feel it came very naturally. My intention was to have a band proper, but it didn’t turn out that way in the long run.
Actually the first song on the new record, “Come Out Shooting”, was from a melody I four-tracked on Jan 1, 1999 and had intended to use for “Weapons”. But for whatever reason I didn’t finish it and it just now finally emerged.
Lujo Records released Brahm/Chaz Barber’s solo record shortly after your debut “Scripts”. Can you talk about your relationship with Brahm and how that came about?
I met Chaz through Shelby during the making of “Weapons”. I think they went to high school together or something. Shelby kept mentioning this guy and at some point after Frodus was done he contacted me to play some guitar on his first record. We just hit it off right away and started making random tracks in addition to stuff for his records, which ended up being the Night Is Invisible record. He was actually in The Out Circuit for a while, played live with us, etc.
Will there be a follow-up to your “Night Is Invisible” collaboration?
I hope so. But we live on the other sides of the country now, so it would be hard. I’m sure we could do stuff long-distance, but a lot of what made it work in the past was being in the same room together and just coming up with ideas on the fly late at night.
Any particular reason Brahm wasn’t on “Empire”?
He is actually, contributed some sounds (which I tweaked a little) on “Scarlet” though he’s credited as “Chaz”. In retrospect maybe I should’ve credited him as “Brahm.” He’s not on it more just because of the distance thing mostly, though he did help me demo some of the songs early on. He’s always been very encouraging with what I’ve done musically.
Have you thought about doing a whole record collaborating with your wife a la Jason Martin and his wife in Bon Voyage or Kevin and Anita Robinson of Viva Voce?
We’ve talked about it. I know she will always be involved in whatever I do. A lot of her impact on this record was less obvious than her voice on that track [Across the Light], but far more important, being an amazing and supportive wife and mother made it possible in the first place.
You use several songs to talk about personal relationships “We”, “New Wine”, “Scarlet”. The latter being to your child, I assume. How has being a husband and a father affected your music or your approach to this record?
“New Wine” is actually about the Last Supper, from the perspective of one of the disciples. But it is also very much about my personal relationship with Christ, so you are 100% correct. Being a husband and father has affected my music and approach to it greatly, and probably in a lot of ways I don’t even realize. There are some practical implications like “I’ll go work on lyrics after I change this diaper” and things like that which just make me laugh. But I think it also helped for me to have a much healthier perspective on what it was I was doing. This record feels so much more free. I did it without putting my family on the altar or sacrificing things that were more important. I didn’t elevate it to something its not, so I could hold it with open hands and enjoy the process a lot more. And now that it’s done it’s something I can feel proud of and yet not worry about what happens with it from this point on. Everything else is bonus.
What caused you to want to use so many guest artists on this record? Were these people just your choices from influential bands or friends?
I am blessed enough to know a crap load of talented people and am always looking for ways to collaborate with them. Most of the time it doesn’t happen, but doing this record gave me a chance to do so with at least a few people. The fact that Thrice and Coalesce are relatively successful bands is a bonus, but both those guys are just friends who are also amazing at what they do. Sean [Ingram of Coalesce] has a wonderful ethic about things and was probably the most enthusiastic person to work on the record which was just what I needed at the time. He really went out of his way to do it and for nothing more than just to do it (as was the case with just about everyone) which is extremely humbling. Plus he’s got a voice that’s brutal beyond brutal. He took the notes I had for that song and really made it his own. Dustin [Kensrue] has been a close friend for several years and we always threaten to work more together. We did once before on a track I did for a Lujo Christmas sampler, ”Emmanuel.” I basically let him pick which song on the record he wanted to do. He wrote most of the words and killed it. The guy is an amazing singer and songwriter. I am just fortunate to know him well enough to ask him to do this without blushing too bad.
“Across the Light”, one of the best tracks (in my opinion) was almost axed, tell me about that.
The reason it was almost axed was because the vocals were thrown together at the end and I didn’t know if it was going to gel or not. I left the studio feeling somewhat discouraged. Sometimes that happens though. You are so deep into something, you just lose all perspective on it. But this is where Jared and Teppei both really shined (among other places). Jared found the best takes and really seamed it together beautifully and Teppei just made it sit perfectly in the mix.
Are there any other songs that were withheld and might be released later on compilations?
I’ve had most of this album in my head and various stages of development for so long that there weren’t any songs that didn’t make the cut. These 10 were it. The only other bonus tracks from the period between the records were “Emmanuel” for the Christmas comp, “This Will Be Our Year” (Zombies cover) for Erik and Jocelyn (of Lujo Records) wedding comp, and “Dark Horizons” (Frantic Mantis cover) for the Lujo Halloween comp.
The track on “Empire” entitled “The Hexagon” lists a Wikipedia image entry instead of lyrics. Was this image inspiration for the song or was it more of an accompanying visual representation, open to interpretation from the viewer/listener?
Open to interpretation. The fact that it’s instrumental makes that more interesting I think. Though I will say that the title is also related to the fact that the song is in 6/4.
Around the last release, you did some limited touring. Are you planning to hit the road for this release?
No plans yet. I’m honestly not that motivated to do so because there’s no money in it (especially for a band my size), and its a huge hassle. I like playing live, but taking time away from my family, work, writing more music, etc, to play some crappy sounding room to 20 disinterested people in an attempt to convince them that they should like the sound we are making just doesn’t sound that appealing anymore. If there seems to be a demand for it, maybe, but there are not a lot of Out Circuit fans out there right now. One idea was doing just a one off show, make it a bigger production, and play the record from start to finish. We’ll see.
The last record’s title “Burn Your Scripts, Boys” was a command. You follow that with another command, “Pierce the Empire with a Sound”. Do you feel your music is a call to action?
In a way, I hope so. But really the titles are more about what I hoped to do when making the particular record, as over the top and abstract as they are.
Matt Johnson (Roadside Monument) plays drums on “The Hexagon”. Is there any relation between “The Hexagon” and Roadside Monument’s release “Beside This Brief Hexagonal”?
Maybe. But not intentionally. Matt is my brother-in-law, by the way.
Lujo artist Hidari Mae covered one of your songs. What was that like hearing their interpretation and what was it like covering a former bandmates project?
I was very flattered that anyone would take the time to do a cover, and I was pretty psyched they did that song. It was very, very cool. Doing the Frantic Mantis song was fun. Like I said in the liner notes, I just got a kick out of picturing Shelby hearing it. Doing that song also helped with some ideas and sounds on the record.
Shelby Cinca did the artwork for “Scripts” and of course did most of the visual work for the Frodus releases as well as playing in Frantic Mantis who is also on Lujo. Now I see Jason Hammacher (Frodus, drums) appeared on Lujo Christmas compilation from last year? Any chance there will be a collaboration between all three of you again? Or a reunion show?
I feel fairly certain some combination of the three of us will do something again, in particular Shelby and I. We’ve been talking about doing something like an ambient record for years. And I wanted him to sing on this last record but it didn’t pan out, perhaps the next one? As far as a proper Frodus reunion, I think there’s always a chance, but the situation would have to be just right. All three of us have been interested in doing it, but never at the same time oddly enough. For me, it would be necessary to really put a lot of thought and practice into it. We would need to sound fantastic, have a great stage show, etc. Everyone committed to the same goal. Otherwise there’s no point. It’s not something that could just be thrown together. I can imagine in the right setting it could be very satisfying to play some of those songs again.
Don Clark (Demon Hunter, Invisible Creature) handled artwork this time. How did you get connected with him?
Through Matt Johnson. He knew them from the T&N days, and from the church we all go to. And Frodus actually played with Training for Utopia, so were all at least aware of each other. Actually, we started a side project with Matt, myself, the Clark bros, and Sean Ingram, which we are currently writing tunes for. Don is another one of those ridiculously talented people who also just so happens to be a stand up guy. I was so psyched with what he did for this record, and considering the record he finished just prior to this one was the latest Foo Fighters record, I am very grateful that he agreed to work on this one.
What are your favorite releases of 2007, if any?
Twilight Sad “Fourteen Autumns and Fifteen Winters”
Thrice “The Alchemy Index”
The Good, The Bad, and the Queen “S/T”
Echospace “The Coldest Season”
Battles “Mirrored”
Website: www.virb.com/theoutcircuit
Label: www.lujorecords.com
Download: Across the Light, Come Out Shooting
Buy: Pierce the Empire With a Sound CD ($10)
Good grief.. do you have to post the whole thing here? It’s like I was scrolling down for days to get to more content.
Hey, it’s Zach. Will he be a regular contributor now or was this a special deal?
Cool interview! Much graditude to Nathan for contributing songd from his various projects to A Week in the Dungeon.
all this frodus talk is making me nostalgic.
sorry about the lack of a MORE tag, guys. I fixed it.
“sorry about the lack of a MORE tag, guys. I fixed it.”
THANK you!
*finds another new favorite band
real quick. jared mcfarlane actually produced this record. Teppei Teranishi mixed it. just wanting to keep things clear.
fixed David, thanks.
[...] Over five years in the making (and well worth the wait) The Out_Circuit’s sophomore release Pierce The Empire With A Sound immediately establishes itself as boundless with the aggressive track “Come Out Shooting” transforming into the dark/soft “Passchendaele” followed by the heavenly dreamscape “Across the Light”. The rest plays out just the same: multifaceted, intimate, heavy and hypnotic. Read the full Buzzgrinder interview here. [...]